Monday, November 6, 2017

A Concise Discussion of Our Main Point of Disagreement.

I've recently been challenged by a reader to provide a more concise statement of my fundamental disagreement with Gangadean. It's a bit tricky to do so because the disagreements are textured and often subtle which requires some detail. But I think it's worthwhile to give up on some precision to make something more accessible and bite-sized.

If I had to boil down my main disagreement with Gangadean I would have to say that it's a disagreement about 1) the need for, and 2) the inevitability of clarity. 

Gangadean's entire worldview hinges on two fundamental claims.

1) That there is clarity at the basic level. Gangadean thinks that it's impossible for some subset of his beliefs to be mistaken or false. That is to say, for a significant portion of his beliefs about reality, it's in the strongest sense impossible for him to be wrong. For instance, he believes the laws of thought are universal and exceptionless. He believes that God exists. He believes that the bible is the word of God. He believes that humans are rational animals. He believes matter is not eternal. He believes that good for humans is to gain knowledge of basic things. He believes that evil for humans stems from failing to know what is clear. He believes that free will is compatible with divine foreknowledge and predestination. He believes that knowledge = maximally justified true beliefs. He believes that the self exists. He believes that the self is not eternal. He believes that reality is composed entirely of either matter or spirit. There are lots and lots of others, but you get the drift. It all supposedly starts from the laws of thought (e.g. 'a is a') and via deduction (or "good and necessary consequences") gets you to an airtight, knock-down, argument for each of the propositions just enumerated (and more!).

2) That, in some sense, we need this kind of clarity. Without clarity at the basic level, without this kind of indubitable certainty of basic things, we're in really bad shape. Worst of all, skepticism (i.e., we can't have any knowledge) follows. But also, nihilism (life has no meaning) follows. Further, without this kind of clarity, there's no point in arguing, or talking---absurdity and contradictions follow.

For Gangadean, the two are related. He uses 2) to support 1). That is, he asks his objector to consider what the world would be like if there was not clarity at the basic level (this is part of Gangadean's "transcendental method"). Would there be any knowledge? Would there be meaning? Would there be any point to talking? Arguing? Could we even have thoughts? If not, then the things enumerated in 1) must be clear to reason.

Where I fundamentally disagree:

I fault Gangadean for failing to make an indubitable case for 2) which in turn undermines his reasons for accepting 1). In other words, he tries to argue for 1) by appealing to 2), but fails to establish 2) and thus fails to establish 1).

To date, I have yet to hear a watertight case from team Gangadean establishing the need for clarity (i.e., thesis 2)). I think that our world could very well be a world in which we can't have that kind of certainty about anything. But importantly, I don't see how nihilism, skepticism, or contradiction follows from this fact. This is where Gangadean seems to make elementary errors in reasoning--by helping himself to unproven assumptions and ultimately begging the question.

Let's take the issue of skepticism since I think that's supposed to be the main boogey-man. In its extreme form skepticism is the thesis that knowledge is impossible for anyone to ever attain about anything. Gangadean claims that without clarity at the basic level, this extreme form of skepticism follows. Further, it would be a contradiction for one to affirm this skepticism, since in doing so, you're claiming to know something (namely that we can't know anything) while denying the possibility of knowledge, something must be wrong. So skepticism must definitely not be true, in which case there must be clarity at the basic level.

The problem with this approach is that Gangadean is already assuming that knowledge is connected to clarity in a way that helps his ultimate agenda. That is, in order to establish the need for clarity, he's helping himself to a particular conception of the nature of knowledge, which requires clarity. But just why should we think that knowledge requires clarity in the first place? Where's that argument? I hope you can see where this is going. If it turns out that we can have knowledge without clarity, then skepticism simply doesn't follow from a lack of clarity. So Gangadean must show that we cannot possibly have knowledge without clarity at the basic level--and to date, he hasn't done so.  He merely assumes as much. [Note the above reasoning is also mistaken because one can affirm skepticism without claiming to know that skepticism is true because affirming isn't equivalent to knowing.]

The same is true of the charge of nihilism. Just why or how does nihilism (meaninglessness) follow from the lack of clarity/certainty at the basic level? This again isn't a thing argued for--it's taken as obvious by Gangadean. Of course, if Gangadean is allowed to define 'nihilism' however he pleases, then the point will be trivial. But we needn't allow that. Or if Gangadean is permitted to stipulate his favored concept of nihilism or meaninglessness, then again the point could be trivial---but we needn't allow that. Gangadean needs to present his case for his favored concept or definition of meaninglessness in the pertinent sense and then explain how it logically follows from the lack of clarity. That's a tall order. Relatedly, why should talk be pointless? Why should arguing be pointless if it's possible for us to be wrong about everything?

Finally, Gangadean's case for 2) ultimately fails because it depends on a bad conflation. Gangadean and his followers are prone to conflate possibility with actuality. To deny the clarity thesis consits in merely allowing that it's possible for all of us to be wrong about even our most basic beliefs. [Recall how Gangadean defines clarity: "for p to be clear to S is for it to be impossible that S is wrong about p"]. Importantly, that's not the same as claiming that we are in fact wrong about the most basic things. The former is about what's possible and the latter, what is actual. To say that it's possible that I could be wrong that God exists, or that 'a is a' is not to say that my belief in those propositions is actually wrong. And if by challenging the clarity thesis I am not saying I am actually wrong about my belief in 'a is a', then none of the other doomsday predictions that Gangadean makes, follows from the denial of the clarity thesis. [Again you have to pay close attention to just what the clarity thesis is--to say P is clear for you, is to say that it's impossible for you to be wrong about P].

It's perfectly consistent for me to believe that God exists while in the same breathe believing that it's at least possible for me to be wrong. Just as it perfectly consistent for me to believe that it will rain tomorrow, while believing that I could be wrong. Even more, in either case, I can rationally remain confident in each proposition provided my reasons provide ample support even if the reasons aren't conclusive. And my beliefs can be correct and the basis of rational decision making. Indeed even in a situation where it's possible for me to be wrong about my belief that God exists, I can know that God exists. Thus, skepticism doesn't follow from denying clarity. Neither does nihilism follow. Thinking continues to happen. Talk and inquiry continues to have a point. Conversations need not end. It's not the end of the world. We don't need clarity not even at the basic level. We can have knowledge without clarity, we can have meaning without clarity--we can fail to have our cake and fail to eat it too.


















15 comments:

  1. Hi J,

    Mysterio here. This is good, but not exactly what I had in mind. I would like you to proceed topically. List each major thesis of Gangadean, and then criticize it in no more than two or three paragraphs. The paragraphs should be free of technical jargon. Maybe some not-so-philosophical Gangadeaneans would read it. Right now, I think your writing is somewhat inaccessible, or at least uninteresting to some people.

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    1. Mysterio,

      I take it that your request for me to move "topically" is that I explain my disagreements with Gangadean over a number of conclusions which span over a number of domains. I think that could be useful--and I've certainly started that project (as noted in the various tabs on the blog). Of course, you're probably right that I haven't been as accessible as I could (and perhaps should) be. So I can certainly work on that. But I think it begins with this post. Many of the problems I raise with Gangadean's conclusions in various domains is that he fails his own standard of clarity in presenting the arguments for those conclusions. So think of this post as a beginning--if the reader(s) you have in mind isn't motivated enough to get a good handle on this post, I'm not sure I'm in a place to help them much. Of course such a person can always ask questions either by contacting me via email or posting comments here if something is not sufficiently obvious.

      Best,
      J

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    2. p.s. If you haven't already, you might also consider presenting the material that I write to the reader you have in mind. I take it that you want this reader to consider counterarguments to Gangadean's views--but in my experience, Gangadeanians tend to be generally unmotivated and insufficiently trained to really do philosophy--these are difficult issues after all (the same is true of the general public of course)! All the more, if their own views are being challenged in the process.

      That isn't to say I'm not willing to work on making things more accessible and clearer--I think that's certainly a worthy goal. But I hope you understand that I've got many other obligations to tend to--which makes my time limited.

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    3. p.s.s. As to your suggestion of listing my areas of disagreement and lending a short (jargon-less) paragraph--I might consider doing something like that although I should warn you that it might not be particularly exciting either since there are a non-trivial number of propositions that Gangadean and I agree on. I am a theist and a Christian at that, after all.



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    4. Hi J,

      Yes, imagine a post comprised of blurbs likes this:

      Material Monism:

      MM is the position that all is matter and matter is eternal. Gangadean has three arguments against it. They are 1,2, and 3.

      1) Gangadean argues matter is not eternal. [one paragraph summary]. This argument fails because it assumes sense perception is reliable, assumes our current scientific evidence is correct, and does not consider other scientific models where the universe is eternal. [or something along these lines] Here are some links to articles written by Christians discussing how the universe might be eternal.


      So this is my idea. Brief statements of Gangadean's arguments, followed by brief, clear rebuttals in plain language, with relevant links to experts and other posts you've written.

      A pastor I once told a small group of us a story. When he was in seminary, one of his professors was Charles Ryrie, a theologian with a very succinct writing style. Ryrie used to say to the class, "I want one page. Not two, not one and a half, one. If you can't express what you know in one page then you don't know it well enough." I love that story.
      It's something as a writer I want to aspire to.

      I hope you understand I"m not trying to be rude or condescending in any way. I actually appreciate your thoroughness. I just think you that more Gangadeaneans would read your post, and get challenged, if your there was a cliff notes version of your philosophy.

      Also, have you ever thought about inviting any one from WF to engage in an online dialogue or debate on your blog? That might get more WFers to read, engage, and be challenged by your arguments.

      All the best,
      The one and only,
      Mysterio!

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    5. Thanks for the suggestion! It's definitely something worth pursuing--and I agree that trying to avoid jargon would be a virtue.

      One thing to keep in mind: I've long given up on the goal of convincing any Gangadeanian--I have come to think (perhaps incorrectly) that it's a fool's errand. My goal instead was merely to inform new students or at most, those in the margins who are already questioning the teachings for various reasons.

      Finally, I think conciseness can be a virtue in certain contexts--but I think your professor's comment is overstated. I just don' think being concise is anything like a supreme value. This is because concise writing comes with certain costs--one of them being the threat of oversimplification and/or the glossing over of important details. In my mind, whenever I write philosophy, there's a constant conflict between certain competing values. For instance, precision often calls us to provide more detail and thus length, because you want to provide ample background, make clear your otherwise unstated assumptions and perhaps even anticipate and respond to objections that might arise to the reader. Of course, this makes both the reading and writing more laborious in certain respects. On the other hand, being brief might make the material more easily ingestible to the reader (digestible is another matter), but as noted above, it has other costs.

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    6. Well, I hope you do end up writing a topical blog, quickly going thru all major topics and refuting them. A thought: That's how Gangadean does philosophy, more or less.(Think of his sheet "Answers to Popular Skepticism".) I wonder if Gangadeanians would respond to it. But yes, I imagine convincing a Gangadeanian would be an uphill battle. Still, if you and, say, Owen engaged in an online debate, some people might have second thoughts. Also, if you're trying to convince people on the margins, short and simple might be best.

      Mysterio

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    7. When I have more time, I'll try something of this sort.

      It's interesting that part of what frustrates me so much about Gangadeanian philosophy is how brief it is--not because brevity is inherently bad, but because brevity requires, in many cases, oversimplification. Good philosophy can't be done with slogans.

      If you're looking for any sort of "real-time" engagement between me and the Gangadeanians--I wouldn't hold my breath. Gangadeanians think of me as one who denies reason--and so there's no point (on their view) to dealing with anything that I'm saying--they think I'm uttering nonsense.




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  2. Also, I'm curious, why have you never criticized Gangadean on science?

    Sincerely,
    Mysterio

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    1. Hi,

      There are some posts where I raise worries about Gangadean's appeal to the findings of empirical science as a premise in his argument for matter not being eternal.

      But there isn't any deep principled reason that I haven't challenge Gangadean on grounds of science beyond the fact that science (and the philosophy of science) are beyond the realm of my expertise. I'm primarily an epistemologist and moral philosopher by trade.

      J

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  4. You've hit the nail on the head! Great explanation. Gangadean just has a failed project.

    I like the more concise breakdown. Gangadean's philosophy can be foreign and confusing, so it helps when you define his terms and make things clear. Lol

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    1. Hey Spencer,

      Glad you found it to be clear and accurate!

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  5. It seems odd to me that G uses a transcendental argument for clarity. If G is using this form of argument to show the necessity of clarity, it would be something like this:

    1. Clarity is necessary for knowledge.
    2. People know things.
    3. So, there must be clarity.

    However, this form of argument seems problematic for G's presuppositional philosophy. G bases his concept of knowledge on the necessity of clarity; however, it seems that G must employ an antecedent concept of knowledge in order to justify the necessity of clarity. To do so, however, is to help himself to too much because his concept of knowledge is informed by clarity; thus, he cannot know that people know things without first knowing that some things are clear. But he can't know that some things are clear without knowing that people know things. Thus, the use of a transcendental argument (in conjunction with his presuppositionalism) seems to put G in an awkward circle.

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    1. This seems exactly right. I've noted that he helps himself to a particular theory of knowledge (one which presupposes clarity) before so I wholeheartedly agree. He's kind of a modern day Cartesian, circles and all!

      J

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